I just realized something...

[twitchybutswirly 0]

first of all, i don't hate America. Just everyone else in the world does because of your beloved Prez. Are you aware that my personal friends had to lie about where they were from to go to school abroad in Wales once they arrived because of the position Bush has put our country in? no, probably not. the students who were honest were ostracized and threatened. nobody said anything about being a smooth talker, again i must explain this. obviously moses had the right idea then. he had someone relay messages in that "smooth talk" you seem to despise. it's not smooth, it's correct. and the word is spelled dephile. jeez. go do something productive...

[twitchybutswirly 0]

And again, where exactly are those WMD's? Cuz if international search team sent in by the UN couldn't find them, we've (and the iraqis have) now blown enough things to bits over there to unearth anything that could've been hidden, obviously they what? AREN'T THERE! And I have no intention of taking a cruel dictator's side, I just think that our money should be spent on this homeland they swear they're protecting. what happened to Osama? why isn't the time being spent on the one who actually did damage. after ignored intelligence reports by bushie, not clinton. he was long out of office when those papers came in.

[Guest MadBadger]

oh lol.... Tanya realy has a point. Bush is one of the worse things to happen to the planet..... at least Hitler had a master plan, Bush dosn't seem to have one (apart from get his mates lots of money)

 

I admit the two things that most pisss me off about Bush is the whole Pro-Life and anti-gay bit....

 

Pro-Life because I don't think its right that a rapists victim can't get an abortion same with some kids who made a mistake.

 

Anti-Gay yes I know its not 'anit-gay' as in burn them all etc but If they can't marry then they don't get to have the same rights as hetro sexual couples which ain't right really. Sexuality is in your genes you can't control it (also why would the big G allow it if its so evil?)

[Cygnus X-1 12]

Yes we could overthrow him. Or attempt to. Youd get shot before you got anywhere (dont F^&$ with the Secret Service)

 

WMDs....lets see, Gassing his own people wasant enough? The scuds used at the begning of the "war" werent enough? The opression wasnt enough? The economic ruin waasnt enough? Im sorry, what the **** do you liberals need to justify a war, a friggin holocaust?!

 

No one said you couldnt dislike the president. But you should at least base your opinions off of facts and reason, not conspiracy theories and hypocritical politicians. Oh, and if you want a real opinion, go talk to the troops in Iraq. Everyone is concerned about WMDs and the Oil and Osama, and you know what? No one seems to wonder "well geeze, we just freed X million people from oppressive dictatorship, improved a nation's economy 20 fold, and removed a middle eastern powerhouse threating to blow...."

 

You call Bush meanspirited and stupid ect ect, yet look at the good we have done and still are doing for hte Iraqi people. You liberals/democrats almost always seem to forget that there are human beings living over there too. They have every right to life that we have.

[BWare 0]

@Renegangsta - :roll:

 

 

@twitchybutswirly -

...roe v. wade gives females the option of having an abortion.

No. Roe v. Wade forces the legality of abortion (or "baby killing' date='" as it's seen by some of us) on the people of the US, instead of us deciding it democratically. It couldn't find any precedent in the actual Constitution, so it actually cites international laws! Unbelievable. It's so poorly written, in fact, that Blackmun's colleagues sometime refer to it as "Blackmun's abortion." Simply put, it's garbage and needs to be overruled.

what bush was trying to do was make all abortions illegal unless medically necessary, which doesn't make too much sense to me considering his party is the one bitching about welfare reforms....forcing women to have unwanted/unprepared for/unplanned pregnancies. what will that lead to? thats right, more welfare mothers.

NO. The welfare queens have unprotected sex like animals with any guy they can find. That will lead to their own poverty... and frankly I'm sick of picking up the tab. On the same note, killing their children seems like a pretty damn cold hearted and sick solution. What would you prefer anyway? Unrestricted abortions at any time for any reason? :shock:

marriage is a right. you have the option to wed whomever you want' date=' apparently as long as you are not homosexual.[/quote']Marriage is NOT a right. Tell me where it's enumerated in the Constitution, if you think it is so strongly. Why is this so hard for you to understand? :roll:

sick of this...i have every right to not like the president i didn't vote for.

True' date=' but you go far beyond "not liking him." Frankly I'm not very happy with him either (though for VERY different reasons)... but you take it way too far (like a typical liberal, anti-establishment, angsty brat)

Are you aware that my personal friends had to lie about where they were from to go to school abroad in Wales once they arrived because of the position Bush has put our country in? no, probably not.

This is a blatant lie. They did not HAVE to lie about it. If they're so spineless that they can't get up the courage to honestly and PROUDLY say they're from the US, then I feel sorry for those losers. I currently have three friends studying abroad in different parts of Europe (including Paris), and they have had NO PROBLEMS proudly declaring that they're Americans. Stop lying- it's a pathetic last resort :roll:

And again' date=' where exactly are those WMD's? Cuz if international search team sent in by the UN couldn't find them, we've (and the iraqis have) now blown enough things to bits over there to unearth anything that could've been hidden, obviously they what? AREN'T THERE![/quote']OMG ya! Itz so simple lolz!!1 :roll:

First of all, the country is a MASSIVE desert. They could be buried anywhere, slowly degrading to nothing. A more likely option is that they were shipped over the border to Syria or some other not-so-friendly country to be further hidden during our ample warning time pre-invasion. The fact that a tiny team in jeeps couldn't find a needle in a massive haystack does not at ALL prove that there were never weapons in development there... and again I cite the gassing of the Kurds. I'm PRETTY sure that the psycho did, in fact, have WMD at some point. Why is this so hard to get through the skulls of some libs?

And I have no intention of taking a cruel dictator's side' date=' I just think that our money should be spent on this homeland they swear they're protecting.[/quote']You'd prefer it if Saddam were back in power. End of story.

And WHERE would you propose we spend the money at home? We have thrown FAR too much money at things in the homeland. If anything, we need to be trimming the fat. Our current system is bloated and wasteful. Nice typical lib talking point again, by the way (do you let them do ALL your thinking for you?)

what happened to Osama? why isn't the time being spent on the one who actually did damage.

He's hooked up to a dialysis machine in a cave somewhere. The vast majority of the rest of the leadership is dead or captured. Big deal. The man who was actually doing the damage in Iraq was Al-Zarqawi' date=' and he just got his. Don't worry- the US military is more than up to the task of fighting those rats over in Iraq and Afghanistan. The question is, though, will you liberal morons allow them to do their jobs?

...after ignored intelligence reports by bushie, not clinton. he was long out of office when those papers came in.

What PAPERS are you talking about?? If you're referring to that ONE daily report given to Bush years ago (the name your president is GEORGE BUSH, not "bushie" you disrespectful brat), it (on top of the many other pages of info) was full of some innocuous historical information on Al Qaeda, and a vague warning that they may be planning attacks in the US. It specifically mentioned a possible use of explosives, which were NOT used in the attacks. The reports never mentioned ANYTHING specific to the 9/11 attacks. The REAL failure was Clinton's decimation of the intelligence community, and creation of a national weakness that allowed the terrorists to TRAIN AND PLAN for YEARS under him. Bush inherited an intelligence and security nightmare (as well as a nice little recession, but that's another point for another time).

 

 

 

@madbadger -

As you know, I'm officially done trying to reason with badger, but this cought my eye...

Sexuality is in your genes you can't control it

First of all' date=' nice runon sentence. Secondly, sexuality is NOT in your genes. There is no scientific evidence supporting your little claim here, so go ahead and quit making things up. It kinda kills your credibility.

(also why would the big G allow it if its so evil?)

The "Big G" doesn't ALLOW it- it's done in spite of Him just like any other immorality. It comes with the territory of free will. Sorry if that's a bit much for you to wrap your little head around, but there it is.

 

 

@Cygnus -

Im sorry' date=' what the **** do you liberals need to justify a war, a friggin holocaust?![/quote'] Brilliant.

You call Bush meanspirited and stupid ect ect' date=' yet look at the good we have done and still are doing for hte Iraqi people. You liberals/democrats almost always seem to forget that there are human beings living over there too. They have every right to life that we have.[/quote']Very, very true. Freedom is a natural right, as stressed repeatedly in our founding documents, that EVERY living person deserves. We've brought it to 50 million people since 9/11, and the libs COULD look at the incredible good we've done.... but NO. They're hell bent on our national defeat and humilation, and will not REST until we've fallen from our superpower status and into oblivion. They only see the bad in us and are invested in our defeat. It makes me sick. These fools are the furthest things from patriots. Their foolishness borders on the insane and the treasonous, and I'm pretty damn fed up with dealing with it.

 

I'm not talking just about these forums, by the way- I engage int ACTUAL debates at my university with people FAR more informed and eloquent than the couple clowns I clash with on here, and at least they pose a challenge :wink:

[Guest MadBadger]

Ugh...

 

Ima just go on bout the sexuality part...

 

Yes it is controled by your genes...

 

Scientists + mice + lab..... they made gay rats....

 

Serriously My Bio teacher showed us the New Scientist article.

 

me sleepy so thats all i say.... BYE! (no wave goodbye smilie.... )

[BWare 0]

I'd like to see those results. I'm thinking that MY bio teachers at my university know what they're talking about pretty well.... and according to them, and modern science, there is no proof yet that genes do in fact control sexuality. If so, then the mechanism of evolution would remove those errant genes from the gene pool. From a biological standpoint, a gay animal or human is a defective animal or human (BIOLOGICAL standpoint- don't misread me).

[Cygnus X-1 12]

I believe the term is natural selection? Besides, how do two gay rats produce gay offspring? erm.....allow me the luxury of though....THEY CANT. End of story.

 

Don't worry- the US military is more than up to the task of fighting those rats over in Iraq and Afghanistan. The question is, though, will you liberal morons allow them to do their jobs?

 

 

I remember an ideology that existed back in the first half of the 20th century. The politicians did their jobs as politicians, and the military was run by the Pentagon (or what passed for it before the current "thing" was in existence) and that in turn was staffed by Military Commanders. And the public for the most part had no problem with that.

 

Then we got into a Cold War, and I think some radiation leaked somewhere. Back in Vietnam years, yes it was hell for the troops, buthte military was held back by political barriers, and civil pressure on the homfront was on a tremendous scale neverbefore seen. Congress hasnt even declared war since the Japanese gave us early X-Mas presents at Pearl Harbor back in '41. And why havent they? Communist invasions werent enough? (Korea, Nam) Middle Eastern Invasion and shutting off of Oil supply wasnt enough (Gulf War) going back in 12 years later and finishing the job and ending a tyrannical ruler and solving a few issues in the Middle East wasnt enough? (Im not even gona both with Bosnia/Serbia '95) Too affraid of home civil pressure. And what is all of this homefront pressure? Mostly calls about Oil hounding (even though gas prices are obnoxiously high) and no reason for invasion ect ect. Too many people failing to realise that we just saved 50 million people that live in Iraq in addition to the countless possible victims should Saddam have been allowed to stay in power. People are really good at preaching that we shouldnt be so greedy and selfish, yet here they are, not a care in the world about the people over "there".

[BWare 0]

It really is a remarkable thing Cygnus. They are the self-proclaimed champions of civil liberties, women's rights, etc, yet they are the first to attack our attempt to bring those freedoms that we enjoy to other countries if it's through war. Is utter selfishness the reason? I really, truly don't understand that contradiction.

 

I think it may tie back to their insane contempt for the US in general. If it makes us look good, it can't be true to them. We are the bad guys no matter WHAT happens. I think that insanity may explain it.

 

 

But let's look at their counter-argument to all this: "Freeing the 50 million people wasn't our motive! You're changing the story! Blah blah blah!" The problem with this is that it denies the reality of that new freedom. Whether that was our motive or not (it's irrelevant), those people are now free of oppression as a DIRECT result of our actions. How can you possibly see that as a net bad on our part??

[Cygnus X-1 12]

If you intend to feed one homeless family and end up runnign a soup kitchen...

 

you are still credited with running the soup kitchen, even if that wasnt your intention.

[BWare 0]

Bottom line: America can never win with these morons. In the case of actual Americans, it makes them traitorous morons. In the case of American politicians, it makes them dangerous traitorous morons.

[twitchybutswirly 0]

i'm not lying. i don't do liars. i should've known you would just try to attack me, rather than just admitting that there is possibly a whole bunch of stuff you don't know about. i know there's a bunch of stuff i don't know about, but i do know that american students at the time were being threatened and attacked. (fall 2002-spring 2003) i think that justifies telling someone that you're from canada instead of america. and you know what else? my friend gary just returned from iraq after two tours. and he does not now nor ever did agree with the war. nor did most of his platoon. they were simply doing their job and made it through two years by treating it that way. and now that he is home, he gets the luxury and thanks of having to go to a shrink twice a week. they won't even let him get a job or pay him enough in disability to not work. lots of thanks for our soldiers. when exactly did it become america's job to "fix" everyone else? and where the f*ck were all these countries that we helped when katrina and all the other natural disasters hit our country? where was our assistance when WE needed it? and i know his damn name i just don't care. i will call him bushie until he has the vocabulary of a grown-up. then he can be georgie. oh, the abbreviation is etc. not ect. (et cetera) duh.

[F15pilotX 4]

my friend gary just returned from iraq after two tours. and he does not now nor ever did agree with the war. nor did most of his platoon. they were simply doing their job and made it through two years by treating it that way. and now that he is home, he gets the luxury and thanks of having to go to a shrink twice a week.

okay...here we go...

<1> The opinions of one PLATOON do not constitute the opinion of the entire military :roll:

<2> He's not the only soldier to ever have to go to a shrink...that's been happening since WWII and mabye WWI :wink:

when exactly did it become america's job to "fix" everyone else?

once no one else would do it :lol:

and where the f*ck were all these countries that we helped when katrina and all the other natural disasters hit our country? where was our assistance when WE needed it?

tsk, tsk, tsk....

 

"Other offers of aid and assistance [for Katrina] have come in from countries around the world -- including from India, Sri Lanka, Thailand and Indonesia, the four countries hardest-hit by the December 26 Asian tsunami. :wink:

 

The State Department said offers of help had been received from more than 50 countries, including:

 

Australia, Austria, Armenia, Azerbaijan, Bahamas, Belgium, Canada, China, Columbia, Cuba, Dominica, Dominican Republic, Ecuador, El Salvador, France, Germany, Guatemala, Greece, Guyana, Honduras, Hungary, Iceland, India, Indonesia, Israel, Italy, Jamaica, Japan, Jordan, Lithuania, Luxembourg, Mexico, the Netherlands, New Zealand, Norway, Paraguay, Philippines, Portugal, South Korea, Russia, Saudi Arabia, Singapore, Slovakia, Spain, Sri Lanka, Switzerland, Sweden, Taiwan, Thailand, Turkey, United Kingdom, the United Arab Emirates, and Venezuela."

 

Google is a godsend :wink:

and i know his damn name i just don't care. i will call him bushie until he has the vocabulary of a grown-up.

now how ironic is that??? :roll:

[BWare 0]

i know there's a bunch of stuff i don't know about, but i do know that american students at the time were being threatened and attacked. (fall 2002-spring 2003) i think that justifies telling someone that you're from canada instead of america.

Maybe... if you're a weak-kneed, yellow-bellied loser. Also, how exactly were your friends being "attacked?" Verbally? Grow up and take it. Physically? Those people are out of control, and buying into that same anti-American propaganda you're eating up. Either way, nothing justifies selling out your country to avoid conflict. That's the very definition of a spineless loser.

 

my friend gary just returned from iraq after two tours. and he does not now nor ever did agree with the war. nor did most of his platoon.

That's pathetic. I can tell YOU that of the many soldiers I know (not just one with a rotten attitude), every one believes that yes, they are doing the right thing. They believe in their mission, and they're encouraged by their fellow citizens back home who believe in their mission as well. You can't support the soldiers without supporting their mission.

 

lots of thanks for our soldiers.

Cute sentence fragment. And yes, I agree that they are, more often than not, given the short end of the stick. It's in service to their country, and is incredibly noble. What definitely DOESN'T help is the kids back home viciously attacking their commander in chief, fat and happy in the land of freedom, thanklessly reaping the rewards those soldiers have bought them with their blood and sweat.

 

when exactly did it become america's job to "fix" everyone else?

We are the world police, plain and simple. Just take a look at what Iraq was actually like pre-invasion... torture rooms, rape rooms, mass graves, oppression beyond your comprehension. Saddam was an evil, ruthless maniac with no regard for human rights. To live under him would be hell. Clearly you have no concept of this, and therefore your opinion carries VERY little weight.

 

Your mind seems to work at this depth: "OMG Bush is dum lolz!!!1 My freind sed so, and greenday concurs!!1 Lol!!!@ War iznt teh anser!" Naturally, we'd be wise to take what you have to say about foreign policy with a very LARGE grain of salt.

 

and where the f*ck were all these countries that we helped when katrina and all the other natural disasters hit our country? where was our assistance when WE needed it?

First of all, how is this relevant? Second of all, I do agree that the world takes us for granted, and when we're in trouble, they're not there for us like we are for them (that makes US THE GOOD GUYS). Thirdly, F15pilotXP just dominated you on this point. Well done sir.

 

and i know his damn name i just don't care. i will call him bushie until he has the vocabulary of a grown-up. then he can be georgie.

You are a miserable, spoiled little brat. It's pathetic, really. :roll:

Under Saddam you'd have your tongue cut out and... well, many other horrible things that I won't go into. But just know that the freedom you sneer at and take for granted, paid for by the blood of soldiers, allows you more than you will probably ever know or appreciate. Go ahead and buy into your MTV generation anti-Bush propaganda. I'm sure it makes you feel like a big girl, making fun of your leader in a time of war and everything. Very nice. Your parents must be proud. They're doing a HELL of a job.

[TheBlackOut 7]

Hell his parents buy that crap too. Arrogant people this country is made up of.

[BWare 0]

Well, it's actually a she (she won't hesitate to point that out :roll:), and yes, her aging hippy parents, in a pathetic effort to be cool and relevant (I've seen it far too much with that generation), will attack the "man," and probably smoke pot with their kids. "Better they do it with us than do it unsupervised!" Ugh. Yeah, there's a good bet our friend here is getting that adorable contempt for America from her parents. Man, that is some FINE parenting.

 

*Bad mood alert. I had to miss a killer concert to deal with a broken down vehicle, and will probably get about three hours tonight before my early class tomorrow on the other side of the city. Not a good night

[F15pilotX 4]

Hell his parents buy that crap too. Arrogant people this country is made up of.

Clear, concise, and 100% correct :wink:

[Cygnus X-1 12]

And now for the biggest irony of it all....

 

The arrogant MTV Greenday Anti-Flag fangroups all complain about Bush and his "stealing our freedoms in the sake of oil" and about how Bush is a "fascist dictator akin to Palpatine ect ect"

 

Notice how there is no secret police going around rounding those people up. They have the freedom of speach, just like every Person in America. So much for the loss of freedoms.

 

They claim that Bush thinks only of himself and his close greedy capitalist friends and that we are in Iraq solely to steal oil ect ect. They claim that Bush and Co. is a group of selfish brats. The liberals and others making these claims refuse to even consider looking at how much we have helped the Iraqi economy, government, and morality.

 

Selffish pigs indeed.....

[BWare 0]

Liberals are morons. Media liberals are even bigger morons. BAND liberals, who think they actually know a damn about politics after dropping out of high school, are the biggest morons on planet earth.

 

 

I love this quote from Alice Cooper:

 

"If you're listening to a rock star in order to get your information on who to vote for, you're a bigger moron than they are. Why are we rock stars? Because we're morons. We sleep all day, we play music at night and very rarely do we sit around reading the Washington Journal."

[Cygnus X-1 12]

Good point, however some rockers do have sense. May I dirrect your Attention to the song Territories by Rush

[BWare 0]

Bah. More of the same hippy nonsense that we see in far too much rock music....

 

Feeling pride in being a "citizen of the world" is a foolish concept. There will always be division and war- only fools obsessed with that pipe dream will walk all over their own flag in the name of "unity" as their ambitious enemies plot their destruction :roll:

 

I for one am extremely proud to be an American, as you all could probably guess. I feel a great sense of pride when my "colourful rag is unfurled."

 

That song has a very communist feel to it..... it's chock-full of all those liberal/communist buzzwords and concepts that are espoused by high school dropout rockers who somehow have the intellectual authority to generalize about history and politics :roll:

 

I'm surprised Cygnus :?

[Cygnus X-1 12]

Me too, you misspelled Cygnus.

 

Actually that song was written by the only non-dropout of Rush ( ) and in my opinion, is not of a Communist air. The song isnt about denouncing your nation for the global community. Yes there will be nations and factions, but the "anger" (if you will) of that song is dirrected more at the wars that are started because of cultural, geological, or social differences. When people refuse to accept others (ie black vs whites, rich vs poor) then we have problems. Problems that are easily avoided when people act with an open mind. Some people take nationality to too far of an extreme. I mean come on, brainwashing an entire nation so that they think they are the "superior race" and then leading them on a mad crusade to take over the world? Just because one man's dream is prejudiced? Thats how I view the song, as a pointer-outer of humanities faults.

 

Neil Peart was accused after the release of 2112 and Grace Under Pressure of being Communist because of his lyrical influences drawn from Ayn Rand. However just because he drew inspiration from a certain aspect of a person does not make him that person.

[F15pilotX 4]

I for one am extremely proud to be an American, as you all could probably guess. "

Your sig shows that

 

edit...took out part of the quote

[Cygnus X-1 12]

I for one am extremely proud to be an American, as you all could probably guess. I feel a great sense of pride when my "colourful rag is unfurled."

Your sig shows that

 

you do realise that he took "colourful rag is unfurled" out of context right?

 

"..than the pride that divides when a colourful rag is unfurled"

 

He is talking about the silly pride that people have for their nations when they take it too far (soccer, rugby matches where riots break out) or the silly US animosity towards the "cowardly" French ect ect.

 

There is nothing wrong with being prod of your nation, but dont let that pride get the best of you against other nations.

[BWare 0]

What about when those other nations, like say... Germany... maybe in the 1940s.... or even Iraq now, get a bit out of hand? It's at that point you need to hold your "coloured rag" above the others, lower your shoulder, and kick ass. It's primitive, it's detestable to the "enlightened minds" of our society (college professors, New Englanders, and rock bands apparently :roll:), and it's harsh, but damn it, it's reality. These haughty lyrics about peace and unity, while I appreciate the dream, are naive and obnoxious. There is still a place for nationalism, and there will always be as long as threats remain against your country and the common interests of you and your fellow citizens.

 

 

Now you KNOW how I feel about people who actually care that much about soccer and rugby matches :lol:

I'm talking about the real life stuff :wink:

 

 

 

Oh and come on... you know that the French fold faster than umbrellas, right? I mean, I could walk down the streets of Paris with a nail in a board, and with the exception of some general rudeness and certain odors, encounter virtually no resistance in my hostile takeover! It could be great fun! Who's with me? Let's go take over Paris! It's kind of like picking up a quart of milk on the way home from work

(now I'm just messing with you)