Christian Jihad!

[comander starlin 6]

ok you just kindled my fire. first of all i am a christen presbyterian to be precise. most of my friends were hard core christens before i knew them and that was like 5-7 years old now 15 years down the track all bar 2 have a criminal record in NZ, they live on the dole, they all got kicked out of there family's because of what they did and to be quite frank here, i hate talking to them because i just don't trust them because every time i have they have gone back to doing there same old habit again, the other 2 lost there faith because of a few incidents in there life, and that helped them one is in UNI and the other run a Farm. hence the reason why i was strong on that one.

 

 

what she is trying to do is what i would call brain washing (Yuri) that little Girl was screaming no to Abortion. lets say 15 years down the track she gets raped or her jock b/f knocks her up, well she say no now? i think not.

also the ABC news article say that that group is strongly against gay marages etc. teaching that to kids is wrong and they know it but it is not stopping them. but the way that particular group go about it it portrays that image that they don't like homosexuals. it is very similar to the teachings of Hitler, on jews and homosexuals. not that i believe Hitler is right in his choice. also most people swing both ways most of my female friends are bi and i have to mates that are gay and they have had a civil union and i don't hold that against them, but to for that group to get up tight about them being together is wrong.

 

Paster Becky Fisher "This Means War" what the hell why the hell would you say that to kids, let alone have them dance dressed up like warriors? that is not an image that goes down lightly, jezz man hello teliban. (the pastor again) "i want to see them laying down there lives for the gospel as they are over in Pakistan, Israel, and Palestine and all those different places". does that put a message out there that they are no better than what is happing over in the middle east, gee the have wars like daily, they are serposable Holy Wars, it is just senseless violence. then there are those to kids who say this.

kid 1 "you know a lot of people die for god and stuff and they are not even afraid."

kid 2 "well it's kind of like being trained to be worriers but in a much funner way"

this is just wrong, God wtf is Yuri controlling their mind's? this is what Hitler was trying to achieve a Country that would just do as he said and be one race (in this case Faith) and be grater then the rest and over power the oppistion. very simmiler to the Aryan.

 

right now i am backing it up even more, i will not take any resopablity to this post because i was asked to deafened my self, hence don't ban me. :x

[BWare 0]

First of all: That post was largely incoherent and confusing. The fact that your logic and thinking is scattered and, well, largely idiotic, didn't make reading it any more pleasant. Sheesh. Since what you wrote was a jumbled mess and I CAN'T quote you and respond that way, I'll make some general counterpoints:

 

I grew up in a thinking Christian household, and I remain a Christian. I've been taught for my entire life that homosexuality is in fact wrong (a VERY common viewpoint, and a right one frankly), and I don't hate gay people. I actually have a number of friends who are practicing homosexuals. I believe that they are living in sin, but I don't hate them. I was also taught that abortion is the ending of a human life. I don't know how you feel about murder, but as a self described "Christian", I would think that you of all people would basically be against it. If you want to go into that particular issue further, I'd be more than willing.

 

Now I feel obligated to AGAIN tear apart your weak and idiotic (and standard) Hitler comparison. For the record.... Hitler was a politician and master statesman who used the simmering hatred of a depressed country to spur them to literal warfare and a literal desire for conquest of the planet. His aims included the genocide of the races that he deemed inferior to his Aryan race.

Alright, got that? Now let's look at these couple nuts that are being used to attack the many thinking Christians like me in America. They are a relatively small, NON-political group who believe in raising their children to be "warriors for God" (in the most extreme example :roll), and that they should be willing to die for their faith. Now let me tell you something- Overseas, there are thousands and thousands of Christians who are killed on a yearly basis. They are systematically wiped off the face of the earth by many different oppressors (Muslim the majority of the time, go figure), and yes, MANY Christians give their lives for thier faith around the world on a REGULAR basis. They aren't joking around when they talk about that.

 

Now they aren't telling the kids to advance on some beachhead or invade Poland dude... they're telling them that there is a spiritual war going on out there. They aren't exactly as ambitious as Hitler was.... and I don't see them using hatred, do you? I DO see the emotional manipulation that angers me as much as you, but I DON'T see them preaching about wiping out a particular race, or murdering ANYONE for that matter. What's the matter with you??

 

To take this and draw a SERIOUS comparison to Hitler is nothing short of vapid idiocy. You should be embarrassed for not backing down from your ridiculous point right away. Defending it only digs you in deeper. :roll:

[Guest Rabbit]

@ comander starlin

 

I'm not a Christian in any way, shape, or form, but, in all honesty, I must agree with BWare here. I don't know where you got Hitler into all of this, because that's just plain stupid. You should honestly be ashamed of yourself for comparing people's non-violent beliefs to a genocidical (sp BWare? ) dictator.

 

Everyone has their beliefs, just as yours, and theirs may be a little extreme, but come on, at least they're not sacrificing babies and slitting their own throats over the matter. Have some common sense.

[BWare 0]

....genocidical (sp BWare? ) dictator.

[comander starlin 6]

i will get back to this at a later date i am with my g/f this weekend, and i will contact BWare direct through PM, but at the moment this topic should be locked because it is going against site rules and quite francly i dont want to be baned sorry

[F15pilotX 4]

jezz man hello teliban.

I'm sure a bunch of 10 year olds will bomb the vatican

[Guest Rabbit]

You're not gonna be banned for this. Technically we are not insulting each other at all, which, in all honesty, should mean this thread is alright.

 

However, we're merely stating what flaws are contained in some of your reasoning, and what F15Pilot just quoted is definitely a huge one.

[F15pilotX 4]

I'm sorry starlin, that was just too good to pass up :wink: they may be nutjobs, but us Baptists have common sense :wink:

[General Leang 0]

Nice trick. I will have to bring this up next time I speak to a religious expert. I think the point however is that these people are not litrially going to go out and kill themselves in a suicide bombing, but your point is clear. How can we criticise Muslim and Islamic teachings if the the teachings of, odds are, our own faith follows much the same pattern?

[BWare 0]

How can we criticise Muslim and Islamic teachings if the the teachings of, odds are, our own faith follows much the same pattern?

Boy, this is a REALLY easy question. Here's the answer: Their religious teachings have led to unspeakable atrocities and the murder of thousands in the last couple years. These guys? Nothing. Bottom line.

 

It sure sounds nice to push the same freaking "We're all the same! Let's all hold hands and sing Kum Ba Ya!" nonsense, but you'd frankly be an idiot to buy into it. Show me the Christian extremist equivalent of 9/11, and you'll have my attention. Until then, knock off the senseless comparisons. :roll:

[General Leang 0]

Thankfully there has not been a terrorist act committed by Christians on the scale of September 11 but there has been violence caused by them. The bombing of abortion centres for example, or the IRA killings that were motivated by religion, these are incidents that occur when any religion is taken too far. The claim that Islam is terrorism is wrong, what people such as Al Qaeda preach is not Islam, but Jihad, intolerance and violence. For the example presented in this video I can understand the concern some may have when Christians are being taught the same way Islamists are. The diffirence however, as you have so colliquently stated, is that Christians are not going to litrially go out to war. Neither are most Islamists, and those who do so do not follow Islam, they follow terrorist teachings veiled as Islam.

[BWare 0]

Abortion bombings? Are you serious?

 

Once again, let me refer to my previous point. There are currently thousands of Islamist "Jihadists" out there who are hell bent on the destruction of the west- LITERALLY. There are camps where they train them to shoot with REAL bullets at targets painted with crosses. There are LITERAL armies of terrorists out there who want people like you and me dead. To compare this massive, GLOBAL movement to the couple isolated abortion bombings from years ago is nothing short of idiotic. And the IRA? You have to be kidding me! They are NOT religiously motivated. Their aims are purely political! They're Christians killing Christians! Plus, they haven't committed anything near what the Islamist terrorists have done.

 

Again, let me ask you to knock off these ridiculous comparisons. They're unfair, false, and ignorant.

[Alphabear 11]

There have been many terrorist attacks on the same scale as september 11 but they were not religiously motivated. Although they havent done anything yet, the fact that they are brainwashing children means that they could do in the future. its the same way other terrorist groups act, the drill it intothe children when they are young so they grow up with those beliefs.

[BWare 0]

There have been many terrorist attacks on the same scale as september 11 but they were not religiously motivated.

Name one.

 

Although they havent done anything yet, the fact that they are brainwashing children means that they could do in the future.

Please... please pay attention the first time. I hate rehashing the same basic points here.

 

Once again, let me point out a simple thing that shuts this argument down. This isn't some new movement that is suddenly gripping the heartland of America. This is a nutty, small group of people that has been around forever. There have pretty much always been nutty Pentecostals out there who teach this nonsense to their kids. That said, what has been the end result? We aren't waiting for it- we've seen it. Bottom line, there have been ZERO violent, terroristic outbursts from these folks anywhere near the scale of some of the violence we've seen recently. Now compare that with the global movement of Islamo-fascism...... yeah. Case in point, done. Now please don't waste any more time by bringing up this garbage point again, okay?

 

 

its the same way other terrorist groups act, the drill it intothe children when they are young so they grow up with those beliefs.

Yes. It's also the same way that atheists are raised. It's also the same way that Buddhists are raised. Hell, it's the same way that bakers are raised!

 

People raise their children by instilling certain values. This vague similarity between these Pentecostals and Islamic terrorists (and everyone else on earth) doesn't actually prove anything. You still have a REALLY loser point here man.

[rEdaSbLood 1]

BWare is right..

 

there is no argument..

 

not even a subjective rebuttal..

 

no ifs,ands,or a$ses..

 

8)

[Alphabear 11]

There have been many terrorist attacks on the same scale as september 11 but they were not religiously motivated.

Name one.

 

State Terrorism. For example the dropping of the Atomic Bomb on Japan was a justified terrorist attack.

its the same way other terrorist groups act, the drill it intothe children when they are young so they grow up with those beliefs.

Yes. It's also the same way that atheists are raised. It's also the same way that Buddhists are raised. Hell, it's the same way that bakers are raised!

 

People raise their children by instilling certain values. This vague similarity between these Pentecostals and Islamic terrorists (and everyone else on earth) doesn't actually prove anything. You still have a REALLY loser point here man.

 

Yes but children of bakers dont say they want to give their lives fighting for their religion.

[BWare 0]

State Terrorism. For example the dropping of the Atomic Bomb on Japan was a justified terrorist attack.

Wow.... wow. I seriously can not BELIEVE that you would even put that in the same category as the 9/11 attacks. That was a, yes, justified act of war... not a terrorist attack. If you want to argue semantics, then keep it to yourself. You know damn well that there's a big difference. There's absolutely no substance to that argument.

 

 

Yes but children of bakers dont say they want to give their lives fighting for their religion.

Dude, do you even understand what I was saying there? Sheesh. I'm not going to even waste time rehashing it. Reread it if you want. But hey, since you're apparently so down on "giving your life" for an ideal, here's a good quote for ya:

 

War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself.

[Alphabear 11]

State Terrorism. For example the dropping of the Atomic Bomb on Japan was a justified terrorist attack.

Wow.... wow. I seriously can not BELIEVE that you would even put that in the same category as the 9/11 attacks. That was a, yes, justified act of war... not a terrorist attack. If you want to argue semantics, then keep it to yourself. You know damn well that there's a big difference. There's absolutely no substance to that argument.

 

It is only because the concept of Terrorism has been hijacked by the media and the coalition that you dont see the similarity. How can you say that the droping of the A-Bomb on Japan did not attempt to terrorise and spread fear amoung Japanese civilians. That is the whole concept of the word Terrorism.

[comander starlin 6]

i was going to avoid this topic but it was not the IRA it was the Protestant vs the Catholics in Ireland. that is what General Leang was getting at, but both of these things happened around the same time.

[BWare 0]

It is only because the concept of Terrorism has been hijacked by the media and the coalition that you dont see the similarity. How can you say that the droping of the A-Bomb on Japan did not attempt to terrorise and spread fear amoung Japanese civilians. That is the whole concept of the word Terrorism.

You are, once again, dead wrong on this. Oh, and, once again, you're the helpless victim of the sensationalized word, *gasp*, nuclear!. It's your contention that the destruction of those 2 cities was a state sponsored "terrorist" attack. What would you call the slower, more agonizing destruction of the many other cities in WWII with conventional weapons? What about the firebombing of Tokyo? What about Pearl Harbor? What about ANY event during a war?

 

Again I invite you to pull your head out of the sand and see the obvious, GLARING differences between terrorist attacks (ie 9/11) and valid military strikes (ie Hiroshima). You seem glued to this point, but please, accept reality and move on.

 

 

On August 6th, 1945, in the midst of a LONG and bloody war, the Enola Gay, painted with the US flag, dropped its nuclear payload on the city of a country that swore to fight us to the last man, even using their demented kamikaze suicide attacks in desperation. They were hell bent on dragging that bloody war out and costing MILLIONS more in casualties. The 2 nukes we ended up dropping were, if anything, an act of mercy! It brought that evil government to its knees and ended a massive, bloody conflict.

 

On 9/11, 2001, A group of nationless terrorist bastards, under no flag but a perverted religious belief and the name of Allah, hijacked four airliners full of innocent civilians, slashing unsuspecting throats and seizing control. They then used those innocent, unsuspecting men, women, and children as missiles. They slammed those airliners into targets in the US designed to cause massive casualties. In this unprovoked attack, a suckerpunch to a nation not at war, thousands of innocents lost their lives.

 

 

The fact that you can unite these two scenes under the same definition is really beyond me. :roll:

[F15pilotX 4]

There have been many terrorist attacks on the same scale as september 11 but they were not religiously motivated.

Name one.

 

State Terrorism. For example the dropping of the Atomic Bomb on Japan was a justified terrorist attack.

:roll: don't make me laugh.

 

those two bombs saved literally MILLIONS of Japanese and American lives by not forcing the United States of America to invade Japan. You may be correct on some things, but you are flat out WRONG on this one. :wink:

 

edit- whoops, didn't realize you covered that BWare

[Alphabear 11]

Dont get me wrong i know it was a justified attack. Im just stating because of its intended target it is classified as a wartime terrorist act. States are responsible for terrorist acts too. The bombing of the Rainbow Warrior is another example.

 

Anyway i have no real motivation on continuing this argument after the fourm downtime as i have lost intrest so i will just agree to disagree from here on.

[BWare 0]

Anyway i have no real motivation on continuing this argument after the fourm downtime as i have lost intrest so i will just agree to disagree from here on.

Define "copout" .

[Alphabear 11]

Im more than willing to stay if you want me to but i figured the the rest of you would be over it by now also. If not then im happy to continue

[comander starlin 6]

Im more than willing to stay if you want me to but i figured the the rest of you would be over it by now also. If not then im happy to continue

 

just walk away trust me on this