Post-Mortem: Tiberium Wars Article

[Silverthorn 0]

I sure hope so, the last time I put my faith in them since after they finished Kane's Wrath, Red Alert 3 is in jeopardy when they terribly drew the Apoc tank, a really bad mistake as though like they didn't take the franchise seriously and I suddenly lost 60% of my faith. I can smell their sense of lack of seriousness, their seriousness can be on the Generals universe but not for Tiberium & Red Alert. That's why you see how come they make the apoc tank so bad and even make the Soviet too wacky instead of being a serious brute force faction. And not just the seriousness, I nearly forgot to mention the boxart, we DID say NOT to use the copy & paste, but they did not listen and still end up using the typical lazy copy & paste again.

 

In the next C&C game, I'm expecting more than that, the boxart MUST be back to the Soldier's Head design. No other types of designs. Imagine if you let EA make a Warcraft 4 game instead of Blizzard, what will the boxart look like? If it's the typical copy & paste of concept arts, angry Warcraft fans will form a mob and start flaming EA badly. After all, WC & SC do use the Soldier's Head design as well. Original old school is an A MUST to follow, especially in the video game industry. Oh, lastly, better NOT EA to use the RA3 Premier Edition boxart as well, that Natasha picture is NO Soldier's Head, it's still a concept art cropped to create as a so called "Boxart".

 

Design of Soldier's Head : Face facing you, either with eye patch or sunglasses. Most of all, show NO expression. The Natasha Premier Edition has an expression, which is absolutely, WRONG!! But also most importantly, treat the boxart as a SEPARATE artwork, Westwood drew their boxart as a separate artwork, copying & pasting concept arts is NO separate artwork, it's just pure laziness!

 

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Let's talk about the music this time which I wonder if the article writer forgotten about it. The music in TW sucks like hell, the obvious choice has to be "Bring back Frank Klepacki", yes, Frank must be brought back. But here's a catch, ENOUGH with those remixes (Remixes which EA made it as a policy or rule for Frank to follow), they don't go very well. Especially HM3 & Grinder 2 are NOT new as they only create bad results which not everyone can accept them. So I also expect the music to be totally BRAND NEW. If for example Frank would to compose a Warfare 2, the music must NOT be a remix from the original TD mixed with techno & electric guitars, NO NO NO! Brand new has always been shinier and better.

Edited April 22, 2009 by Silverthorn

[rEdaSbLood 1]

you guys write too much, lol

[Nmenth 291]

Read it, agree with it, hope EALA does the same.

 

(How's that, rEdaSbLood?)

[jamhaw5 0]

I agreed with most of that article, still I think the franchise can still be saved.

[Nmenth 291]

I think the franchise can still be saved.

One would hope so...

Assuming EALA realize they kind of shot the canon with a machine gun, burned it, and then dipped it in acid, how can they fix it in C&C 4?

The problem is, damage done. So what then, pretend it never happened and make C&C 4 return to the basic story? Give explanations for why everything changed and keep it this way even though it isn't as good?

Personally, the only way I can think of that would make the most sense is that the tiberium nature temporarily shifted with the arrival of the Scrin and/or because of Kane's tiberium explosion. Like all the mutated animals hid from the chaos or possibly sensed the Scrin were dangerous, the explosion may have caused chain reactions in the flora that caused it all to splatter and could have also blown up all the blue tiberium.

[rEdaSbLood 1]

thats a decent solution nmenth...and yea about the writing alot - they wrote essays lol...scroll up

[Mighty BOB! 5]

I don't think all of the damage done is irreversible, although I think the change in Tiberium is too late. :/

 

It's bloody radioactive now, which you could say killed off most lifeforms, however, this means EA can come up with brand new mutations that have adapted to this new strain of Tiberium. Although I want the Visceroid blob back since it is a basic enough mutation (pretty much just protoplasm) that it could survive both environments methinks.

 

As for the music, screw the orchestral crap. Screw the dynamic crap. Techno and synth music for the win, and give me a playlist.

 

Heck you can even keep the track order dynamic, but there still needs to be a controllable playlist, and the tracks must be a minimum of 2 minutes and 30 seconds each. NO LESS.

[mirza044 4]

regarding faction coloration, somewhere in the article has been mentioned that is blue reserved for only Scrin faction, with which I disagree. There is also CABAL faction which uses blue in TS FS. Yes, EALA made huge mistake when they used orange/blue colors instead gold (yellow) coloration for GDI.

PS

Maybe somebody should write a new article about what EALA done good in C&C3 TW/KW.

[Malevolence 6]

I guess at this point of time its kinda too late to cry over spilled milk. What's done is done, don't bother lifting your hopes of a remake too high. The only lesson the development team gets is to listen more to the community and share with us details, maybe not all of us, they can choose the best of the best C&C fanatics to go over over some criticism before finalizing the product.

[BioBen 3]

You have to bear in mind that even if a game is starting to look crap, I pretty much guarantee all of us will buy it purely because it's C&C, If EALA have this thought then the universe is ****ed.

In regards to the article, i agree with most of it, I want tiberium environment and lifeforms to be top of the list if EALA decide to fix this mess.

GDI is gold not orange btw.

[rEdaSbLood 1]

very true bioben...and yea complaining now won't change the game, but hopefully with these concerns in mind, the next game (?) will be more C&C..

[Silverthorn 0]

I guess at this point of time its kinda too late to cry over spilled milk. What's done is done, don't bother lifting your hopes of a remake too high. The only lesson the development team gets is to listen more to the community and share with us details, maybe not all of us, they can choose the best of the best C&C fanatics to go over over some criticism before finalizing the product.

 

Yes, it does hurt us. But EA has to remember, the more they miss out our main points or ignore key things. The more our interest will fade. An example, for the Americans, I'm pretty sure you do know what happened to the McDonnell Douglas plane company or any failed airline companies, they gambled peoples' lives just for the sake of earning money, & what do they get in return when a crash or something bad happens in flight, huge millions of dollars fines as well as a huge humiliation! So far I hope EA better not go on the path which humiliate themselves. Earning money is normal, but it must NEVER be treated as earning money for the sake of the business itself. Pleasing the fans is more important than pleasing yourself.

 

Speaking of calling in the best of the best fanatics, I hope EA does that, calling one or more into their studios is WAY BETTER than contacting them by email or forums, our fans will definitely need to supervise the visuals just in case if the developers or artists screw them. The Kane's Wrath units which they listened to us, which I felt like the dev team listened to us only by forums, not by calling in the best fans to the studios. They may no longer have the original C&C founders, but they have us. If I would be called into the studio for example, I'll be watching them on the boxart and make sure the Soldier's Head will return, by forum or email is nothing as I will not get to see the artwork, which results of mistakes or bad designs which I do not approve. As usual, call the fans into the studios, if there's one to freelance and willing to work for the franchise, do pay him. Paying a small fee (Like $800 or more monthly) to them is NOT a huge different from a business which earns thousands of dollars every year. Come on, one (Or up to 3 if you're calling in 3 best fans) small fee doesn't hurt the entire budget, it's just like you take 1 candy from a bag full of 1000 of it, will it show any difference? I don't think so.

 

As for the music, I got the feeling that the old classic soundtracks are better. Like in Red Alert 2, I wasn't been bothered by the music, it's just played like a radio. But in Red Alert 3, ah ah, no way, bro, I started to think that music based on fighting events or victory or defeat is starting to make me feel like it's not good for the game. It gave me mixed feelings which I find that unnecessary.

Edited April 23, 2009 by Silverthorn

[Nmenth 291]

As usual, call the fans into the studios, if there's one to freelance and willing to work for the franchise, do pay him. Paying a small fee (Like $800 or more monthly) to them is NOT a huge different from a business which earns thousands of dollars every year. Come on, one (Or up to 3 if you're calling in 3 best fans) small fee doesn't hurt the entire budget, it's just like you take 1 candy from a bag full of 1000 of it, will it show any difference? I don't think so.

I think there'd a large supply of fans that would be more than willing to advise them for free. Not that they shouldn't pay them, but it probably wouldn't be necessary to do so.

[Mighty BOB! 5]

You have to bear in mind that even if a game is starting to look crap, I pretty much guarantee all of us will buy it purely because it's C&C,

I'm not touching RA3 with a 60-foot pole.

[Silverthorn 0]

I think there'd a large supply of fans that would be more than willing to advise them for free. Not that they shouldn't pay them, but it probably wouldn't be necessary to do so.

 

Only the very pure hardcore fans (Preferably Westwood traditionalist) will be invited. So-so fans (Even including myself, which I'm typically only a Red Alert fan) won't not be invited and only restricted to the forums.

 

Like I mentioned, forums they'll listen, but we can't see it visually. Like the last time they keep on doing the boxarts without our approval, in the end, hardcore fans are angry which the Soldier's Head design was not in used, moreover, remember the original RA3 boxart, below Natasha's black areas are really bad & meaningless. If we are there in the studios in person, we could resolve that issue and prevent it from happening. After all, only the very few pure hardcore fans will come over, EA doesn't need 100 or so to be brought over, that will be very expensive for their budget.

 

Moreover, even the music as well such as HM3 & Grinder 2 are NO GOOD! If the hardcore fans were present to supervise the whole operation, trials & errors can be reduced. And I mean it, one day of fan's supervision is not enough, throughout the entire production days will be our cover. Remember, EA no longer have our original C&C founders, the fans will take their place in their offices until the product is finally finished.

Edited April 23, 2009 by Silverthorn

[Renamon 0]

but i like orchestral and dynamic crap (Techno and synth music for the lose). and the logo change, and the predator design, and how the sonic cannon isn't lout and annoying, and hell march 3/grinder 2. also lol at any slanted structure reminds me of obelisk of light, 'Westwood traditionalist', and 1.. ok 3 fans dictating ea. oh man, this threat

Edited April 23, 2009 by Renamon

[rEdaSbLood 1]

some may say why would we bring in hardcore fans, they represent the past? C&C needs to keep up with the times.

 

maybe only graphically. the hardcore fans hold within them the spirit that made C&C95 such a success. we love the core elements of C&C, and our opinions could carry those elements into the future of the gaming universe to bring forth the same success it had in the first days..

Edited April 23, 2009 by rEdaSbLood

[hagren 0]

*New logos. Well the GDI logo changed between TD and TS but was it really necessary to change it again for TW? It's just stupid.

Objection! The new GDI/Nod logos were created by Westwood themselves.

 

As for the article, I agree with almost everything, but find it's release a bit late- Now it's only causing bad blood whilst EA corrected many of their mistakes with RA3.

 

[sith_wampa 6]

Objection! The new GDI/Nod logos were created by Westwood themselves.

 

As for the article, I agree with almost everything, but find it's release a bit late- Now it's only causing bad blood whilst EA corrected many of their mistakes with RA3.

Too bad EA made RA3 have nothing to do with the main C&C storyline anymore, which is what this article is about. RA3 has its own problems anyway.

[Malevolence 6]

In regards to the logos, EA originally changed GDI logo and featured them on some screenshots and trailer. The community couldn't take it and started whining and complain about it. EA decided to revert back to Westwood's GDI logo based on a scraped project on C&C3. With the fans knowing that its done by Westwood, everyone suddenly became very happy with the changes of the logos.

[Silverthorn 0]

I also find the logo is fine by me, the GDI logo was unchanged since they brought it back from TD, TS was Steel Talon's, definitely cannot be transferred for C&C3. Zocom is no problem, good job. As for the Nod logo, adding the spikes is a touch up well done and I have no problem with it. Marked of Kane, simple, but I wish there's more. The Black Hand, no problem, I find it more suitable than the a little bit complicated old Black Hand logo back in Renegade.

 

And a bad GDI logo done by EA? I wish I could see it and how was it look like?

[mirza044 4]

Objection! The new GDI/Nod logos were created by Westwood themselves.

You are right, and there are many stuff which were created by Westwood and later used by EALA in final version of C&C3.

[Malevolence 6]

I also find the logo is fine by me, the GDI logo was unchanged since they brought it back from TD, TS was Steel Talon's, definitely cannot be transferred for C&C3. Zocom is no problem, good job. As for the Nod logo, adding the spikes is a touch up well done and I have no problem with it. Marked of Kane, simple, but I wish there's more. The Black Hand, no problem, I find it more suitable than the a little bit complicated old Black Hand logo back in Renegade.

 

And a bad GDI logo done by EA? I wish I could see it and how was it look like?

 

ZOCOM and Steel Talons symbols were rehashes from Westwood's Tiberian Sun concept arts. Marked of Kane and the new Black Hand should be original work of EALA. Marked of Kane looks a little weird for me, kinda reminded me of a pokeball. The new Black Hand's logo design was very simple, literally a hand. Lol. Of course the new Black Hand symbol has to be different from Renegade because these two subfactions were different.

 

This was EA's recreation of GDI logo in C&C3. It didn't make it into the game as fans were pissed off at it and some criticized that it was Generals' USA logo ripoff. At the end of the day EA decide to revert back to Westwood's cancelled C&C3 concepts.

 

I have no idea where I got this from, but it was Westwood's cancelled concept art. As you can see, Westwood retooled on the logos for the third time since TD and TS, and added a new faction, I assume its the scrin. From the looks of it, it seems EA copied GDI and Nod logos into the final game.

 

 

More of these stuff can be found in CNCSource archives. You'll be amazed what else they stored there.

Edited April 24, 2009 by Malevolence

[hagren 0]

Too bad EA made RA3 have nothing to do with the main C&C storyline anymore, which is what this article is about. RA3 has its own problems anyway.

Objection! Westwood Pacific already severed the ties with RA2. And to be honest, I prefer it stayed this way. Isgreen's explanation would have been tacky. And yes, RA3 has some minor issues (Length, "story", pathfinding, talkative FMVs), but it's almost close to perfection.

[Mighty BOB! 5]

As for the article, I agree with almost everything, but find it's release a bit late

 

Well the point of the article is that if EA is indeed making C&C4, this should (and does) summarize most of the root issues that people had with C&C3 that EA should use as feedback for C&C4's possible design.

 

I think someone on Project Perfect Mod made that. I can't remember who off the top of my head, but someone over there likes making detailed vector logos. Can't remember if he said that 3rd logo was based on original concepts he saw or if it was a design he created himself.

 

And I liked the Ren Black Hand logo.