French and Dutch reject EU constitution.

[Tree 0]

I DESPISE INTERNET EXPLORER!

 

I just wrote a huge thread on this subject, and right as I put the final smiley, IE crashes. Well, I guess I'll write it again.

Anyway, back on subject...

 

France and Denmark have both voted no to a EU constitution. and i for one applaud them. Some may say that having the EU making everyone conform to a universal language, currency, measurement scale, etc is bad, and they would be right. But this is what they are doing. Well, I had more thoughts on this issue, but I cant remember them. I'll post them later.

 

I could care less if everyone speaks the same. That would make it easier, but changing currency is the thing I have a problem with. A while back, I traveled to Europe, and went through a lot of different countries. In every country, I got some of their currency, which is cool. Its a sort of their culteral background. Currency is what makes a country unique. Lots of coutries speak English, or French, or something. But only one country has/had pounds, Francs, Dinars, Schillings, Levas, Kunas, Korunys, Kroners, Marks, Guilders, etc. Making Europe conform to one currency, one language, one set of laws, one idea is ludicrous.

 

Of course the reason the French did not vote yes is because of the immigration laws that the EU constitution had. But still. But, the French vote was 45% yes, 55% no. Too close I think."Some critics said the constitution embodies unfettered free-market economics that would undermine the French welfare state and allow countries with cheaper labour to take French jobs. Others said it did not go far enough to promote European integration. " The last time a European treaty was put to a vote in france, it passed by only 2%. So there are enough smart people in France to reject it, but too many stupid people who want to tag along blindly with the rest of Europe.

 

Meanwhile, in the Netherlands, 61% rejected the constitution. "There was also considerable dissatisfaction with the euro currency, which some Dutch blame for inflation, and anger that France and Germany have got away with breaking EU rules on budget deficits." The same article also says that the Dutch think that a "social Europe" is not good. And frankly, they're right. The Dutch want to think for themselves. BBC says that "This may be because neither the "No" side nor the "Yes" side has been putting forward one coherent message, but the people have also been thinking for themselves.

 

One person talks about the euro, the next about tion by bigger EU states. Another will talk about Brussels bureaucracy, or the threat to Dutch liberal values, or loss of sovereignty and national identity, or the motor of European integration speeding out of control.

 

Many Dutch said they were worried that the EU is expanding too fast" Its a good thing some countries are thinking. That is, France and the Netherlands are thinking.

[Luk3us 63]

You should use Firefox then...

 

Anyway it doesn't worry me if the European nations form their own little union. It would be good for people like me (aka tourists) going through the countries...

 

But they'd probably use their identites if they formed the EU...

 

Not that its going to happen now anyway... Don't they all need to agree?

[BWare 0]

The day is coming folks... US vs EU vs China

[chickendippers 1]

Yea, if all the countries don't agree to it then it won't happen - so it's not gonna happen.

[dapperdan 0]

I am glad that the french and dutch voted no. When two of the most prominent 'forces' in the EU vote no to something that will 'enhance' the workings of the EU (dnt make me laugh) it shows it for what it really is, a piece of paper that tries to make every single person and nation to conform to a 1 set of ideals made by some unelected beaurocrats on a power trip. The only shame about the whole thing is that Teflon Tony prolly won't hold a referendum here and so yet again gets t ododge the issue.

[Thierry 0]

I'm 17, so I wasn't allowed to vote yet...grmph...

 

I would also have voted no, mainly because it gives other countries (especially the lesser rich countries) way to much power over the other countries. This could lead to economical trouble.

They also say that the constitution would mean that we would have to send military assistance to an EU country under attack...HELLO! As if we wouldn't do that anyway....

[Guest MadBadger]

NO i dont want to be in the EU the Euro is a crappy type of play money i prefer the pound and i am invading france as well

 

http://www.france.com/mb/messageview.cfm?c...mp;threadid=885

[Thierry 0]

Yeh, the Euro did really screw a up a lot of stuff.

Almost everything went up in prices in the Netherlands when the Euro came.

 

1 euro is 2.20 guilders.

 

I bought a game in december for 49,95 in guilders before the euro, in february after the Euro the same game costs 49,95 in euros...that kind of stuff was everywhere.

It all went up, except our income...

[Waraddict 0]

Thierry, guess which country got the constitution through to each of the European governments, little guess, it wasn't one of those big ones.

 

To brief my view on this, I would have voted 'Yes' because I trust the EU and it has done good for my country so far and we owe a lot to it.

 

I would also vote 'Yes' as I would prefer my culture to be overan by European culture rather then American culture because afterall America IS a very influential force and I am European not American. And like it or not, unless a balanced political force happens to come about America will spread it's culture, not that it isn't a bad thing, it's just that I am not American.

 

To expand the depth of this topic though I will reveal that yes there are plenty of reasons why to vote 'No', but before going forward I would like to say that so far alot of people are voting 'No' for the wrong reason such as to voice their opinion about Turkish membership which was simply not an issue.

 

The real reasons to vote 'No' to me are the constitution itself, but lets be honest, it certainly is no dramatic attempted to bring about a single European state and there certainly was no mention of having one language, but what I believe was wrong with the constitution was how utterly rediculously large and over-complicated it was, how on earth did they expect ordinary people to make a well informed decision on it? Surely they knew that practically nobody could get the full idea of what it proposed and would thus create myths and fears about it?

 

The second reason is the EU's opinion on dynamic culture, although there was no dramatic plan to unify our cultures the EU certainly doesn't make the preservation of each of the EU countries' cultures a priority, if the EU promoted healthy cultural differences between each country there would be alot of benefits, the EU would not be seen as a threat to sovereignty and EU would be a hotbed for tourism, just think of being able to visit 25 different countries without the complications of traveling between country!

Unfortunately, the EU's failure to recognise the difference between supporting a dying national language and a minority language was a clear sign they haven't got things right, national languages, no matter how many speak it, should be given priority over minority languages (languages which have a small number of speakers and are not belonging to a country). It was disspointing for the EU not to recognise the Irish language as an official EU language, Ireland is suffering a cultural crisis, the EU should atleast not make it worse.

[dapperdan 0]

I am European not American.

 

Shame to hear that you think yourself as a European. I will always be known as English first, British second and eventually if worst comes to worst, European. i am proud of my national identity and i will oppose anybody, anything and any piece of paper that tells me otherwise. The difference between america and europe is that the people ni america are proud to be american. You will find very few people who can say that they are proud to be called 'european'. The problem with europe is that it tries to represent too many people and too many national identities. The french want french to be the main language of europe despite English being the world language. They have one set of laws and we have another, they benefit from europe, we do not. Europe has one sole aim, to be and opponent to america and china. The people's interests are not their main concern, their wallets are. hopefully europe will never become a super power.

[Staude 0]

only a sith deals a ultimatum .... j/k

 

i think of myself as danish.. not european... and i dont like europe either.. havent done anything good for us .. atleast not very much.. and they keep pressing on with constitutions and stuff and want us all 2 be united way 2 much.. they talked about getting a united president.. how demokratic is that.. and europe does remove the things in the country that makes it unique. beside.. who would want another language to be a higher priority in your own country than your own. i dont want it to be french, english, spanish, italian, swedish or any other.. i want danish to be the main language in denmark.. and english to be in england.. the other thin is crap...

[apocolyp4 0]

i want danish to be the main language in denmark.. and english to be in england..

 

And here you are posting in english. Why are you not typing in Danish after all your in Denmark and why are other posters from other non-english speaking countries posting in english instead of their native tongue? The reason is that its a common language that we can all understand what every one else is saying without needing to translate what everyone else is saying.

 

The reason making english the primary language for the EU is to make it easier for the nation of europe to comunicate with each other. Its far easier for example companies to talk to each other in one language instead of having spend alot of time and money translating who said what especialy if their is companies from a dozen nation working together on the one project.

 

I am Scottish but I also proud to call myself European even more so than being British.

[dapperdan 0]

I think most scots would take ur view on Britishness. most scots would prolly rather be called anything other than British. Tell me, what are your views on a independent scotland?

[Staude 0]

i want danish to be the main language in denmark.. and english to be in england..

 

And here you are posting in english. Why are you not typing in Danish after all your in Denmark and why are other posters from other non-english speaking countries posting in english instead of their native tongue? The reason is that its a common language that we can all understand what every one else is saying without needing to translate what everyone else is saying.

 

The reason making english the primary language for the EU is to make it easier for the nation of europe to comunicate with each other. Its far easier for example companies to talk to each other in one language instead of having spend alot of time and money translating who said what especialy if their is companies from a dozen nation working together on the one project.

 

I am Scottish but I also proud to call myself European even more so than being British.

 

english is like SECONDARY i dont know if uve heard that term.. my primary is danish but i dont speak it here because that i want you all to understand.. but i want to walk down the street and speak with my gf on danish.. with my family on danish and with my friends on danish.. i want 2 watch the news on tv in danish. iwant the idiotic sport commentator in the boring matches to say all kind of crap in danish.. i want to go to the supermarket and see danish signs.. i want to read LOTR on danish.. i want to listen to danish music.. i want to demonstrate in denmark.. i want to see all kind of danish ppl on my money.. i want to see the 3 danish lions on the back of them.. i want to wear a shirt that says "luk røven spasser" så du ka nok forstå hvorfor jeg skriver her på engelsk kan du ikke ?? ... GODT SÅ !!

 

...and the only country which have english as a primary language is england .. in eu ...

[apocolyp4 0]

Peronsaly I do not want Scotland to become fully independant, but rather self-autonomous as in the Scottish Parlement to stop someone like the Evil Bitch Maggie Thatcher treating us like scum e.g. poll tax. I wouldnt be in the best interests of Scotland or Britain as a whole for us becoming independant as we would go back to being one of the lesser countries of the world with little influence. As I sometimes say to my friends when both Scotland and England were Independant all we did was fight amoungst ourselves. When united we created the greatest empire and ruled a quatered of the globe.

[apocolyp4 0]

iwant the idiotic sport commentator in the boring matches to say all kind of crap in danish

 

I wish They would speak danish during the football as well as I cant stand John Motson.

 

The consitution made the EU to have its primary lanuage as English and not for the nations to adopt english as it primary language. The reason for having one main language for the EU is to make it easier for the member nations to do bussines with each other. Dont blame the EU for all the English thats invading Danish society, blame the Beatles as they were the ones who made learning english popular in Europe.

 

I dont see a problem with having to use 2 languages in day-to-day life as where I live most of the time when speaking to friends or even people in the street we dont speak english as such but rather glaswegian which if any of you have watched programmes like Rab C Nesbit you would have noticed it needed subtitles for people out with scotland to understand. When at school, work, or any other bussiness then we talk in perfect english all be it with a sexy scottish accent

[Saracen 16]

I don't mind all this talk about the Danish considering they gave us Peter Schmeicheal, Danepak bacon, Carlsberg larger, and a little known Heavy metal band known as Mnemic...

 

But please, so what about the English language being such a strong presence over there... get over it! It's only the most commonly used language in the world :roll:

[apocolyp4 0]

I have to agree with you King about Danepak bacon and Carlsberg larger.

 

Danish Bacon, Danish Bacon, Yummy Yummy Yummy Yummy Yummy Yummy Yum :lol:

 

But isnt chineese the most used language in the world? But then does that count since most of them are squased in the one country and english is more wide spread.

[Guest MadBadger]

To be frank i preffer being called English than british. I dont realy feel that Scotland should be a part of britan. They have there own parlement (that cost waaaay too much). So if they want to be so independant they should finance there own army and we can just invade them again :lol:

[Saracen 16]

The Scots rule dude!! We are all part of a United Kindgom afterall :wink:

[apocolyp4 0]

You do know that most or the army are scottish and that you should notice that in most of the footage and pictures of british tanks most recently in iraq do not have the union jack on the but rather have the St Andrews Saltire on them this is because the main british tank battle group are the scots dragoon guards. Also that 80% of the SAS are scottish. So if we became independant and england invaded it wont just be a couple of clansmen but rather the best of the British armed forces

 

I dont realy feel that Scotland should be a part of britan

 

Why is that as it was OUR King James VI that unified or nations and created Britain as sybolised in the pound coin with the loin and the unicorn old foes uniting to defend the british crown.

[Cygnus X-1 12]

Unification has its purposes. Like in America. hmm.......What if Europe was like American government, with one nation, but many smaller provinces or states. The government would be in 3 levels, Federal (all of Europe) state (former countries that are now states of the EU) and local (cities)

 

Hehe, once again though, that would be an American influesnce in Europe.

[Waraddict 0]

I am European not American.

 

Shame to hear that you think yourself as a European.

 

I don't 'think' I'm European, I AM European, and so are you, I was merely stating a fact, describing myself as European simply indicates that my nationality is one of those that reside in Europe, that being Irish.

 

Being European and Irish is not a mutually exclusive thing, besides you cannot BE European on its own anyway.

 

Next time try thinking.

[Mina Synd 0]

Global & European politics are one of my main hobbies as i try to follow political news and i study history. Quite frankly i just can't be bothered to argue against anyone that thinks the EU is a good idea. Too many to argue with at once for a point i can't win (brainwashing is a bad thing. especially if the person believes in the ideal anyway) To all the americans who do not follow the EU policies directly, the majority of countries being bullied into the EU do not get a good deal out of it. Only the main EU countries get the benifits, everyone else gets suckered basically. i don't know exactly what the other countries have going on (though i'm now a lil more updated on a couple more countries) for the UK it really offers very little (or at least England. It gives a few bonuses to Scotland) basically we pay the EU money, we take all their refugees, we lose out all our trade routes with our current traders (ie: America, Austrailia, NZ etc etc) and a lot of out strong products get cancelled (ie: the fisherman's lose out BIGTIME) as well as this, because the pound is worth a lot more then most european currencies, if we changed we'd lose out on a lot of stuff.

This is one of the only times i agree with the French... The EU is a real bad thing for most of us over here... i mean the only thing we'd get back from the EU deal would be group protection. What can half of these countries offer the richer nations? we'd simply be worse off then now. (NATO gives us all the allied backup from europe we need pretty much

I know a lot of that sounds like a biased view, and it is a little. But at the moment the UK isn't even in the EU, and we're paying them £55 Billion a year, and getting £5 back (remember conversion rates) and that was a couple of years ago... i'm pretty sure it's gone up since. now that £50 billion if being used could easily buy dozens of hospitals and keep them running, or maybe improve schools more. or the police force. We need the money and where is it going? To the EU. it's not even like they are giving it to the poor countries... they give something like £20 billion of that money to poor countries, but where does the rest go? The goverment says if we were alone without the EU we'd be screwed. last time i checked we were never with them until now and we've done just fine with the UK, the americans and aussies on our side... i mean heck we only had a fricking Empire that covered a fair amount of the world XD!

 

And yes, we do treasure our links with Scotland... and those boys in Iraq fighting their hearts out for us. but lets be honest, (no offence) most Scots are crazy gits who love a fight. why shouldn't they be the UK's best combat units? i know i'd much rather have a scot by my side in combat then some british couch potato ^^;

 

Please don't assume that any of the previously mentioned comments are directed at any one person or country... it's directed at the written policies of the EU and how they affect England as a whole. Please add any details of the EU's affect on your country, and if you're another Brit, please feel free to argue - i could use a laugh n.n

[Waraddict 0]

Britain IS in the EU, perhaps you're getting confused with the Eurozone which is the part of the EU which uses the Euro.

 

I don't know whether Britain has gained anything or not, but I can tell you Ireland did, without the EU we wouldn't have obtained such a good Economy for over the last decade, then again, economy isn't everything, farmers for instance are finding trouble with the EU.

 

I suppose that's one of the main problems with the EU, it DOES improve a country's economy, but it doesn't necessarily improve everyone's income, only greatly improves a select few.

 

Perhaps the EU should focus just as much on general quality of living aswell as economy?